EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT PROJECTORS IN HUMAN DESIGN WITH ERIN CLAIRE JONES
EPISODE #11: EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT PROJECTORS IN HUMAN DESIGN WITH ERIN CLAIRE JONES
In this episode, Leah continues the Human Design Energy Type Series with an episode dedicated to projectors with Erin Claire Jones. She shares all of the following:
01:34 What is a Projector?
03:03 The Projector aura
04:41 Projector strategy
09:56 Projector signature and not-self themes
15:01 Some Projector TLC
25:42 Rest for Projectors
34:19 Pop HD versus Source HD
38:18 Human Design language
We bring on the Human Design Expert and Projector, Erin Claire Jones, to talk about her experience as a Projector and being a leader in this space. Leah, 5/1 Sacral Generator, and Erin, Projector, chat about everything related to projectors. Erin details how she uses her strategy, themes, and more to live in alignment with her human design. They also share the difference between Pop and Source HD and some of the language used in human design.
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RESOURCES MENTIONED:
The Method - enrolling for 1:1 clients
Erin's info
ADDITIONAL RESOURCES:
Follow Leah on Instagram @thedesignofyou
Book a reading with Leah
Intro/Outro song is 6am by Young Mooski
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:35]
Leah: What's up guys. Welcome to another episode of the energy type series. This episode is all about projectors, and I'm so excited because later on in this episode, I bring on the famous Erin Claire Jones. If you're not familiar with Erin Claire Jones, she is one of the leading voices in the han design space.
[00:00:55]
Leah: So if you've dug into han design a little bit, I'm sure you've come across her work. She, , It's so great at taking the han design information and really breaking it down into something practical and and Erin is just someone that I deeply admire on so many levels. I have gotten to work with her.
[00:01:13]
Leah: I've gotten to learn from her. She has one of my necklaces. We've, you know, just DM back and forth about different things and I've talked about different parts of kind of the han design world in this community, and she's just such an incredible voice, and it was so great to actually talk to her and hear from her about what it means to be a projector.
[00:01:34]
Leah: But before we do that, all of the previous episodes, I'm going to go through and talk about just the basics around projectors. And, you know, one of the things that I think is really important to know when we talk about projectors is that. They kind of have this massive role in the future on when I say future, honestly, the very close future on why this is, is because projectors are kind of the leaders of the new paradigm, and we're going to do a whole episode on new paradigm and and the whole conversation around that.
[00:02:04]
Leah: But essentially, in 2027, we're kind of entering this. New energy around the world where things are going to sort of shift and they already have shifted. So, you know, obviously what's happened in 2020 and just kind of the trickle effect of different systems and things starting to break down in 2027.
[00:02:22]
Leah: We're really going to start to see that shift kind of fully take place and projectors are going to be the people that really guide us and lead us through that. So they're so special. They're so cool to talk to personally in my life. It's so funny. I. I have only a couple projectors in my life. My dad's a projector, both of my aunts are projectors.
[00:02:41]
Leah: One of my good friends, Nina, she's a projector and really that's about it. It's funny because one of the things that, you know, I've realized about the different types is that we all sort of clustered together. So a lot of people that I hang around with are manifesting generators and generators. And, , a lot of projectors I know have a lot of projectors around them or a lot of manifestors I know have a lot of manifestors around them.
[00:03:03]
Leah: So it's always so interesting to me to see kind of how that unfolds. So when we talk about projectors, the first part we want to talk about is really just the aura of a projector and the aura of a projector is that they are very focused and absorbing. So being a projector, they're the type of people that.
[00:03:22]
Leah: When they walk into a room or when they're around people, they're kind of penetrating the awareness and they're absorbing all of the information around them. And they're very focused. And so projectors are called projectors because they have this ability to , they contend to or sometimes have this, , problem, I guess I should say where they can project onto other people and it's because they are so focused and they absorb so much, they see things projectors are oftentimes called the seers and the guides and the leaders.
[00:03:54]
Leah: And I want to just say to with this, , because something that I experienced when I first got into han design was. You know, my entire life I have held leader leadership positions and I've had different areas of my life that I've really feel I've been a guide. And so I want to just say, when I talk about the different language, if you are not a projector, it doesn't mean that you can't guide and you're not a leader.
[00:04:17]
Leah: It just means that projectors energetically can kind of move the energy around. They're kind of guiding the other energy types. And we're speaking energetically, not necessarily characteristically. So projectors, they are called projectors because, because they can see so much and because they're so focused and because they can kind of absorb all the information, they, they want to give advice and they want to feel seen.
[00:04:41]
Leah: They want to feel recognized. They want to be invited in. And the best thing for a projector to do is to wait for an invitation or recognition before offering their advice before working with others. And so if. You've gotten to the strategy piece of your own design, or if you're a projector listening, the strategy piece.
[00:04:58]
Leah: It really speaks to how can we strategically use our energy as whatever type we are to work with it and to bring ourselves the most aligned opportunities. And so projectors, it's to wait for invitations and recognition because when they do that, they allow themselves to not only be seen, but to also be heard.
[00:05:17]
Leah: And so when we talk a lot about the wait for an invitation thing and wait for recognition can get kind of confusing, but. It's essentially this way that you can use your energy to avoid essentially projecting on to other people. So, projectors can sometimes just project onto others and, and when they don't wait for those invitations or they're not recognized first for their brilliance, it feels uncomfortable for the receiver of the information and for the projector.
[00:05:44]
Leah: And so projectors fall into feeling lots of times bitter because they're , I don't feel seen or no one's, you know, recognized me for the gifts and the brilliance that I have. The strategy again, when projectors wait for invitations and recognition, it's someone actually sees them and someone actually is inviting them in or they recognize them.
[00:06:05]
Leah: And so it allows the projector to move about in the world with the least amount of friction and to really make an impact versus , if they don't do that, then, you know, they can't really make the impact that they wanted. , a couple of questions I get around projectors is , this is one that I got that I, I share pretty often.
[00:06:22]
Leah: It's , so I just have to wait around all the time for people just invite me to do things. And, and the answer is no, no. And yes, it's a double sided coin. So first, when it comes to dating, for example, if you are, you know, Putting yourself out there on a dating app. That's great. You know, I always say projectors put yourself in the places to be seen to be recognized, you know, if it's social media, put yourself out there so people can find you.
[00:06:47]
Leah: People can't recognize you and see you unless you kind of embrace who you are. Projectors are really good at devising systems and mastering their craft. And so it's really important for projectors to , you know, find their thing and just , Do it for them and know that when they, you know, spend time on what they love to do and they master their craft, that more and more invitations and recognition are going to follow.
[00:07:09]
Leah: So it's also about kind of putting yourself in the places where people can find you and see you. So for dating, for example, this is one that I got. Someone was , I hate being a projector. I just have to wait for people to ask me out on a date all the time. , they have to invite me first. And I was , okay.
[00:07:23]
Leah: , I hear you, but also , you know, if you're on a dating app and someone swipes and, you know, swipe, I think it's swipe right. I haven't been on a dating app in a long time, but I think if they swipe right and you swipe right, then that's a match. And I'm , that person energetically saw something in you.
[00:07:38]
Leah: They see you, and so therefore, they want to invite you or they recognize you, and so there you go. You know, same goes with anything in life. I think really the nber one thing to know as a projector is that if you are, if you have an idea or you want to start a business, it's okay to It's okay to, you know, go do something and, and, you know, I don't say a manifesto where it's to go push and force and create manifestos.
[00:08:06]
Leah: The only ones that can initiate things, but projectors can still if there's something that they're enjoying doing. It's , okay, . You know, learn more about that, master your craft, do your thing, you know, devise your systems, break down structures. You know, they see things in such an upgraded way because they absorb all the information around them.
[00:08:22]
Leah: So it's continue to do that. And then just know that the right people are going to find you, you're going to find your tribe. And it's also recognizing who doesn't recognize you and who's not inviting you in and, and maybe figure out ways that you can. You know, not either be around those people or, you know, I always say you can sort of hack the system, but it really, it's not a hack and, and that doesn't feel the right language for it.
[00:08:45]
Leah: But, you know, if you're a projector, something that's very resourceful for you is just asking if your opinion is wanted. So imagine you're a projector and you're in a group setting and maybe everyone's having a conversation about something and you could potentially say, Hey, , would you my advice or do you want my opinion?
[00:09:05]
Leah: Asking, setting yourself up to ask the question allows you to see if someone's really receptive to hearing you, if they recognize you. So what would happen in that case is if the person looks at you and says, , yeah, I would love your opinion or I would love your advice. Okay, there you go. You have an energetic invitation.
[00:09:22]
Leah: There's a difference though, if they were , yeah, sure. , what do you think? That doesn't really feel an energetic invite. , so really kind of notice who is paying attention and who's not in really, if you're a projector, , try not to, you know, offer your advice or opinions without being recognized or asking that question.
[00:09:39]
Leah: I think you'd be surprised the amount of people that are willing to hear it, but sometimes the energy that just happens from your, your aura being so penetrative is , if it's not invited, it feels kind of unsolicited advice. And so that never feels good to anyone. Right? So that's how projectors operate.
[00:09:56]
Leah: Their signature theme is success. So the sign that a projector is in alignment, they're going to feel successful. So success is really, , indication that a projector is, you know, mastering their craft, doing their thing. People are recognizing them, people are inviting them in. And so they feel successful because the right opportunities are showing up by them working with their energy.
[00:10:16]
Leah: When they're out of alignment, they're going to feel bitterness. It's going to feel , again, no one sees me. No one hears me. No one's inviting me in. No one's , you know, complimenting me or wanting me to share my. You know, all my insights. And so I'm just bitter. And so bitterness is really just an invitation for you to again, wait, wait for invitations and recognition.
[00:10:37]
Leah: And just, you know, kind of focus on you and trust that everything's going to fall into place. And again, some tools are to, you know, ask, ask if you can be heard. Some words for projectors. So intense, absorbing, tactful, deep, brilliant, observant, compelling, penetrating, focused. Rational and really the gifts of being a projector.
[00:10:59]
Leah: So there again, natural advisors, leads, guides, teachers. They're innately sensitive and wise about people and how other people can leverage their gifts. They're really good at seeing other people because again, they kind of absorb that. , they're also really gifted at seeing things in new ways. And, you know, they're really here to show us that success is rooted in ease.
[00:11:20]
Leah: So one of the things that's really important to know, and you may, if you're in the han design world, you may have seen the memes projectors need naps and, and for sure, they absolutely do. And why this is, is because, so the sacral center in han design. So the centers are basically the shapes.
[00:11:36]
Leah: So the squares and the triangles and the diamonds that are in your body graph and some are colored in and some are not colored and when they're colored in, it means that that's defined energy that you have and no projectors have a defined sacral. The sacral is the second square from the bottom and that's what makes a generator a generator or a manifesting generator a manifesting generator.
[00:11:57]
Leah: It's basically the generator sacral life force gut feeling motor and projectors do not have that defined. And neither do manifestors or reflectors, but it's important to note for projectors because, you know, projectors really live in a world where It's all about the generator and it's all about this life force.
[00:12:16]
Leah: And they sometimes can be conditioned to overwork themselves or think that they have to work too hard when in reality they are not designed to sustain work for long periods of time. It's super counterintuitive and it seems kind of not what you're used to, but projectors really are people who Need to give themselves breaks, they will get more done and be more successful and more in alignment when they give themselves the chance to rest and rejuvenate and, you know, not push so hard, not hustle hustle culture is, I don't know, that's falling apart within this whole paradigm shift, but also it's extremely, extremely important for projectors to not fall into that hustle culture and that Overworking and doing and, you know, projectors are designed to, to again, just be a lot more easeful in their day to day.
[00:13:12]
Leah: They're meant to, you know, have energy ebbs and flows and they aren't meant to go, go, go all the time. So more gifts about being a projector. They are really good at asking the right questions. So use that to your advantage. If you're a projector listening. They're really gifted at taking a bird's eye view and helping other people use their energy best.
[00:13:31]
Leah: So whether it's a coach or a CEO, mastering a system, refining an existing process to make it more efficient. Or just developing new ways of doing things. They're really good in one on one settings. If you have a projector in your life, or again, if you are a projector, find ways to work one on one with those people.
[00:13:48]
Leah: , they really enjoy feeling seen in that capacity, rather than being in a group because sometimes they can kind of just get lost in the crowd. , and they're just really natural learners. So some of the challenges for projectors is overworking and overdoing, being overzealous, you know, trying to do everything themselves, trying to keep up with the hustle culture, you know, trying to push through their tiredness and exhaustion to get a bunch of things done.
[00:14:13]
Leah: When, you know, again, it's so funny, it's , so ironic, but really projectors, I always imagine it a bow and arrow where when they allow themselves to lean back, , so imagine bow and arrow, kind of being pulled back, that's a rest, when they allow themselves to rest, they go so much farther, so much quicker, so it's a projector could do something, they could overwork themselves for, you know, three hours trying to get something done because they're just , I have to, or I'm being forced, or, you know, I'm working and hustling.
[00:14:42]
Leah: think Where as if they rested, and then they approached it in an easeful way, they would get more done in an hour, versus the three where they killed themselves over it, so. It's something to remember that projectors, the more that you rest and give yourself that space, the more that you're going to be more productive, ironically, you know, if you feel burnout as a projector, that's a sign that your condition in the sacral center, it's a sign for you to rest.
[00:15:07]
Leah: It's a sign for you to let go of commitments. So one of the most important things is just not finding your worth through productivity because it's never going to come that way. So I always leave with some TLC tender love and care for all of the energy types and. So the mantra that I offer to projectors is that the only recognition I need is my own.
[00:15:32]
Leah: The only recognition I need is my own. Projectors, remember to play. Have fun. You know, don't get, don't be too serious all the time. Have fun. And the more that you play and get your hands into the things that Are exciting to you that are, you know, systems that you're wanting to, , learn more about finding new ways of doing things, you know, play, have fun, get your hands dirty and trust that, you know, the invitations of recognition are coming and , you don't need that.
[00:16:03]
Leah: It's just more helpful when you're working with others. Look out for proving your worth and overworking. The remedy for that is rest. And an affirmation for projectors is, Not everyone is meant to see me. It's not personal when they don't. Again, not everyone is meant to see me. It's not personal when they don't.
[00:16:26]
Leah: Okay, so write that down. Journal that. If you're a projector, say it out loud. And I wanted to leave with just some famous projectors because this is always super fun. So Taylor Swift is a projector, Barack Obama, Marie Kondo, and Marilyn Monroe. And there's lots of other famous projectors, but those are just some to name a few.
[00:16:47]
Leah: And I cannot wait for you guys to hear the second part of this episode. We talk a lot about what it means to be a projector. And you're going to hear directly from Erin Claire Jones, one of the leading voices in the han design space. She's incredible and I always learn so much from her. So stay tuned for that and I will see you on the other side and next week for our final episode in the energy type series.
[00:17:13]
Leah: It's going to be all about reflectors and I have so many reflectors who have been DMing me commenting on my post that are , I want to hear about reflectors and it's coming. So. I can't wait for you guys to tune into that, but for now, enjoy learning more about projectors.
[00:17:36]
Leah: All right, guys, we have Erin Claire Jones here, which I'm so excited about because I, if you guys listened to the first part of this episode, I talked all about how I worked with Erin and her amazing, , just courses and different things that she offers. And so I'm just so pped to be able to get a little bit of her magic into the podcast and hear about what it's to be.
[00:17:58]
Leah: A projector. And so without further ado, Aaron, I'd love to hear what it's to be a projector and then just introduce yourself and everything for the in between.
[00:18:10]
Erin: Yeah. So my name is Erin. I'm a 6/2 projector. I have been working with han design since 2015 now, and it's been a real journey. And so amazing to kind of watch him grow.
[00:18:23]
Erin: I think in terms of being a projector, I think it was very confronting when I first discovered it, you know, I was living in New York city. I was in a very entrepreneurial community. I was 25. I was , I'm going to be such a straight manifesting generator in every single way. And when I was told I was a projector, it felt so resonant, but also really confronting.
[00:18:41]
Erin: , I was just , am I really allowed to find success that way? , could it really work? And so it's been a really amazing journey testing that hypothesis and seeing that things really do work better. But I will just say being a projector is really informed everything that I do. , I think that it is really informed how I build my business and that I'm not doing it alone, you know, and that I'm really surrounded by a lot of support that really allowed me to kind of just do what I do best.
[00:19:07]
Erin: It's really informed the way that I show up in my partnership, you know, so much of being a projector is up being deeply recognized. , I married my best friend, the person that made me feel the most seen before ever being romantic with him and friendships, you know, I let go of a lot of friendships and really found my way into new ones because I really knew that, , there are a lot of people that I love being around, but , didn't make me feel deeply known at all, you know, and so, , and so I think really Channeling my energy into the relationships that felt really, really reciprocal and really diving deeply into those.
[00:19:35]
Erin: So it's changed everything about how I do everything, you know, and I also grew up with a father as a projector. So it was, , a good, a good model for me, even though he didn't know what I didn't know. Wow.
[00:19:45]
Leah: Well, I love that you answered that because I was just going to ask you, you know, what was your first reaction when you found out that you were a projector?
[00:19:52]
Leah: And so you kind of said that when you had first originally heard about it, you're , Oh, that was really confronting because you're, I mean, we live in a world that really kind of goes against the grain of everything that a projector or really a lot of the other types too, that they stand for and not necessarily stand for, but they're designed for.
[00:20:09]
Leah: And so I can imagine that being very confronting. And I even feel that way as a generator. That was something when I learned I was a generator, it was , You know, and it's funny because I was just talking about this yesterday is that when I first found out that I was a generator, I was actually bmed because I actually felt I align more with the projector sort of language around leader and guide and all those different words that are tied to it.
[00:20:34]
Leah: But as I've come to understand being a generator, I found out that I'm very much a generator and I'm definitely not a projector. And so it's very interesting when you ask people, , you know, what it, what was that? , what did it
[00:20:45]
Erin: feel ? So yeah. And there's , you know, design envy or it's , I want to be that thing.
[00:20:50]
Erin: And , but I also find that , and I share this often, I think the more that we align with our design, the more we fall in love with it. And , it's so fun to, and I'm sure you witnessed that in clients, but , I just remember clients that , we're , Oh, I don't want to be this. And then a year later they're , I am obsessed with my design, you know?
[00:21:07]
Erin: And so , it just really. Fun to watch that transformation because there's no good or bad in han design, you know, and , I'm so in love with being a projector. I'm also pretty obsessed with all the other types because I have them in my life and I'm , Oh, thank God for you. And Oh my God, I need you.
[00:21:22]
Erin: And , Oh, what gifts you have. So I think that it's, it's fun to kind of go on the journey because I think that the more we do, the more we love who we are.
[00:21:29]
Leah: Yeah. I love that so much. What is something you feel more people need to know about being a projector?
[00:21:36]
Erin: I think that, you know, and this is, I guess, kind of true for all the types, but I think that it can be, it's easy to be , Oh, this type can't be this or this type shouldn't do this thing.
[00:21:46]
Erin: And so , I just hope that no one hears that their projector and think they're limited from doing a certain thing. You know, I think being a projector will change the way that you show up and how you're meant to do it best, but it doesn't mean you can't be a certain thing. , I also wish that more people knew, you know, I think when we hear that we're here to be invited in.
[00:22:02]
Erin: It can feel a little bit disempowering at first. And it definitely did for me, you know, because again, I was in this very entrepreneurial environment and I was , I have to be invited. That sounds how in the world am I going to find any clients? , and I think what I've really learned and discovered is that the invitation is not there to hold me back.
[00:22:19]
Erin: The invitation is there to really just protect my energy and make sure that I'm conserving it. I'm not wasting it on people in places that aren't ready for me, you know, because when I'm really invited in, I So much energy and , I feel so valued and , it's an amazing experience. But when I'm not invited in, my energy gets depleted very quickly.
[00:22:37]
Erin: I feel really bitter. So I think that , I also hope people start to see the invitation as a tool to just protect your energy and make sure you're placing it in the right places. And then one other piece I would share is that. As with all things, han design is here to be experimented with. And so I've experimented with the invitation so many ways, you know, so it's never about sitting back.
[00:22:55]
Erin: It's about mastering your craft, recognizing yourself, letting people know that you exist, exploring ways to make yourself visible. So also kind of exploring ways to work with it in a way that feels really fruitful and sustainable for you. Yeah.
[00:23:08]
Leah: With the invitation piece, what is something that you would advise someone who is new to han design?
[00:23:14]
Leah: They find out that they're a projector and they're being told to wait for an invitation. What are some tips? And I ask this because my dad's a projector and I would say he's a very unaligned projector sometimes and he's new to han design and he's learning at his own pace as I kind of drop little nuggets to him.
[00:23:32]
Leah: But yeah. Something I find is that the waiting piece is really challenging for him, , to hear. So what are some tips that you would give projectors just when they hear that and, and some advice just as they're, you know, kind of starting to experiment?
[00:23:47]
Erin: I think a lot of projectors I sit with, they , they kind of realize it because what I always remind projectors is that , It is so innate for you to just see it all you just look at the world and you see all these things and so it's very natural to want to share everything you see because you see so many things that could be so valuable if people listened but if people aren't ready to listen and it's going to land on deaf ears and feel why did I even share that and so I think that I just usually have people kind of reflect on those moments you know I'm just what it feels to share when they really feel invited and what it feels to share when they don't but I also would say As projectors first discovering this, I would just take the time to reflect on where in your life you feel the most invited in and recognized and seen.
[00:24:27]
Erin: I just see what it feels . And honestly, it might be one friendship. You know, it might be , I don't feel invited anywhere, but by this one friendship, but I think starting to really establish that as your standard, you know, so I think just taking the time to really See what it feels and how different it is.
[00:24:42]
Erin: Because I think that for me, what helped me align with it even more was just realizing when I felt invited in, everything was different. And so it was always worth waiting for that moment. And again, knowing that waiting is kind of a weird term, , yes, you're here to be invited in, but , invite, invite yourself and recognize yourself in the meantime, really cultivate make yourself really worthy of being recognized by so many people.
[00:25:05]
Leah: Yeah, I love that waiting is something that I've been talking about a lot because I mean, basically all of the types are designed to wait for something besides, you know, manifestors. And so the waiting piece is very counterintuitive to the sort of culture that we have, where it's , you know, go after it, go do it, you know, create your reality.
[00:25:23]
Leah: And, and I'm a big fan of, you know, totally manifestation and figuring that out, but you're not going to, you're not going to bring anything to reality in the way that. It was meant for you. If you're going to, you know, force it right, you have to kind of sit back and wait and and kind of see where your gifts are for projectors specifically to, , see where your gifts are recognized.
[00:25:42]
Leah: , what is a common misconception about projectors in the world?
[00:25:45]
Erin: I just , I don't know how you feel about this. , I hate the language of non energy types. They're often projectors or reflectors are referred to as non energy types. And why I don't that term is that I think a lot of projectors think that .
[00:25:58]
Erin: They don't have energy. Projectors, our energy ebbs and flows, the idea is that it's just not meant to be consistently active all the time, but letting pauses happen, allowing space, leveraging the energy when it's there, resting when it's not, and so I think sometimes there can be such a conception that we just don't have the capacity to kind of make things happen or we don't have energy and it's We do, and it ebbs and flows.
[00:26:20]
Erin: And the more we ebb and flow, the more we'll experience it. And if you're going to enter, if you're a projector and you genuinely feel so much energy to do a thing, which you ly will, if you feel really invited in, leverage it, use it, enjoy it, you know, don't I've had clients , Oh God, sit back and rest, but I'm not tired at all.
[00:26:36]
Erin: . Create space for us, but tune into your body to see what you actually need. And so I think I just want projectors to know that , this is not about not having energy. It's just about not forcing consistent productivity and allowing a more kind of natural ebb and flow throughout your days.
[00:26:51]
Leah: Yeah, 100%.
[00:26:53]
Leah: I always tell projectors and reflectors and really manifestors to , you know, if you have the energy, use that energy. And if it's not there, it's That's your body saying, okay, it's time to take a break. You don't have that sacral that's, but even, you know, someone who's a sacral doesn't even have energy all the time either.
[00:27:10]
Leah: Yeah. None of us do. So I love that you noted on that. , what inspired you to start doing han design and becoming a han design reader?
[00:27:21]
Erin: Yeah. I mean, my journey was a little bit weird because , I didn't really, , I wasn't , Oh my God, I discovered han design and experimented with it for a year and then was , I'm going to offer it.
[00:27:30]
Erin: I, , I met a stranger in 2015. I was at a friend's gathering and he did a little reading for me on the spot. And immediately after offering me this reading, which was my first introduction ever to han design, he said, Aaron, I think you're meant to do this. , and I think that we're meant to do it together.
[00:27:46]
Erin: And it was , as you know, han design is not predictive. I had never heard of it. It was 2015. No one I knew had heard of it, but he was more observing, I, that I had a lot of gifts in my design for kind of simplifying things and being able to kind of , I love all these mystical systems.
[00:28:01]
Erin: And also there was a lot of compatibility between our design. He was a six. You end up. That's it. You're the 43, 23, don't you? 43, 23 and the 61, 24. And, , and we were both 6 2s. , and he was, had just turned 50 and I was 25. And so we were in very different phases. , and then also, oh, and we'd together created the, , I call the total management also known as money, the 21, 45.
[00:28:24]
Erin: So he was just , this is amazing, you know? , so. It was a really interesting thing because I was invited into the system that I had never heard of. And so , I think that I was just at such a perfect moment in my life where , I was consulting for a bunch of companies and enjoying it, but not , Oh my God, this is my thing.
[00:28:41]
Erin: And I think when he started to show me the layers of han design, which honestly immediately was the layers of how to use han design and teams and how to kind of layer team charts on top of each other, I was blown away. And so, , Yeah. So we started building a business together pretty quickly, you know, and, and we did for two years and we offered every single reading together looking back.
[00:29:00]
Erin: It was , not the most business smart, but you know, we're, we're the most efficient with our energy, but it was an amazing experience for us.
[00:29:05]
Leah: And I think that, , that's you being a three, right. And, , the first phase.
[00:29:10]
Erin: Yeah. And I, and it was also so funny because , and you'll understand this, it's , you know, so I was at 25, I was in a really experimental phase of my life and he was at a more kind of , I'm 50.
[00:29:20]
Erin: I'm kidding my pride. I've been sending him to that for a decade. It's time. And he was , Aaron, this is not a great time for me to partner with you because you're in such an experimental time. And , and I was , no, this is it. We're going to be in this for life, you know? And then things change, you know?
[00:29:34]
Erin: And , and we had different approaches to the system. And , I started my own practice a couple of years later. And so it was just really interesting because he knew that he recognized it so early on that I was , in such an experimental phase. And I was really resisting that. So that's how I got introduced to it.
[00:29:48]
Erin: So it was, and again, in 2015, people were not talking about han design. it was so hard for , you guys, this is so cool. And , I actually quit in 2017 for four months because I was , no one cares. I can't force awareness of a system that people just don't understand or see.
[00:30:07]
Erin: I came back to it because I had to, but I think that that's how I started. That's how I got started.
[00:30:11] Leah: I love that story. I've heard it before and I just wanted to have one of my listeners to hear it. I just think it's so powerful the way that you were invited in and it's so interesting what you say to about 2015 and it being such a just something that no one was talking about because I found han design in 2017.
[00:30:27]
Leah: And I remember looking at my chart and going. Okay, , what does that mean? And I remember kind of looking a couple things up about what being a generator means. And the language was just, you know, so confusing to me. And I remember just kind of, I have a screenshot on my computer from my old phone of my chart.
[00:30:44]
Leah: And, and then I just never did anything else with it. I kind of forgot about it. And then I always say han design kind of finds people and it kind of came back around to me. In 2020, and I was , oh, yeah, that han design thing. And then all of a sudden, there was a lot more han design information out there.
[00:30:59]
Leah: And so, as I started to kind of dig in, I was , oh, wow, this is really cool. And so I was really prompted to get back into it. But I can imagine in the beginning years, it was. It was probably yelling, yelling in a room where no one's hearing you. It's , look at han design. It's so cool. It can change your life.
[00:31:16]
Leah: What did that feel when you went into specifically corporate settings, because I've never played around with that because, and I think when I first got into han design, there was a lot of apprehension to it being, you know, somewhat woo woo. And people were , what are you doing? And so what was that bringing han design into more corporate settings and, or business settings of people who may be .
[00:31:38]
Leah: You know, we're interested in something that.
[00:31:40]
Erin: Yeah. I mean, I, it's, it's so funny to think back because , I feel teams are kind of the people that get excited after all the individuals do, you know, but , we were teams first, you know, we're going to bring you a designer team, but none of the individuals were excited yet.
[00:31:55]
Erin: So , it was just, You know, I think that people were definitely far more receptive than I ever imagined, you know, so it did not feel we were walking into teams of people , what is this? Because as you probably discovered, people want to learn about themselves, whether it's woo or not.
[00:32:07]
Erin: Yeah. So I think that my experience there was that , it was just a real. crash course and how to present han design in a really accessible and empowering way, you know, because I was working with people that were , not really down to believe it. And so really learning how to go in there and be , okay, this is a really cool tool.
[00:32:24]
Erin: Let's talk about how it can be useful. Even if you're , Aaron, this is totally weird and totally out there. And so. I think that it just gave me a lot of practice in terms of how to communicate about it in an empowering way, which obviously kind of translated into everything else that my business became.
[00:32:38]
Erin: But yeah, I mean, thinking back in terms of being invited in, now it's , I love working with teams, but , I also know the right teams will find me and I just never force it before they do. And so that now it feels a bit easier because I'm not kind of forcing a thing that they're not ready for.
[00:32:51]
Erin: As you know, han design is such an amazing tool to help us understand the people around us, whether it's our kids, partners or colleagues. And when you sit with a team, it makes them feel so recognized. It makes them feel so connected to each other and it gives them so many practical tools to kind of work with each other on a daily basis.
[00:33:06]
Erin: So the impact is pretty tremendous.
[00:33:08]
Leah: I've never experimented with bringing it to a team and it's something that I've thought about trying and seeing what would happen. And so I just think that that's really interesting to hear about kind of the way that you began. And I think it speaks so much to the work that you do in this space because So I've taken Aaron's course.
[00:33:25]
Leah: It's phenomenal. I mean, she's an incredible teacher and the language you use where you were , Oh, I call it the management channel. I've totally adopted your language because it is so much more accessible. And I can imagine that when you were in those settings, it was, it gave you a place to really break it down to go.
[00:33:41]
Leah: Okay. There's a lot of people in this room that. You know, perhaps aren't interested. There's a difference when someone comes to you and they're , Hey, I want to learn han design, you know, schedule a session with you and they already have sort of that interest there versus when you're invited into a team, there's definitely going to be someone, a part of a team that's, you know, has nothing, has no interest in that.
[00:33:59]
Leah: Potentially. And so it's you really had to create sort of a way to make the system digestible and impactful in their lives. So, so cool, Aaron. , and this actually brings me to kind of a sidebar question. So as far as language and han design goes, this is a huge topic. I feel lately, especially on Instagram.
[00:34:19]
Leah: There's kind of this , , I would say kind of this tension there would, I would say around the han design space between different languaging and how people speak about certain things. What, what's kind of your thoughts on that? And , I guess sort of the pop HD versus the source HD, , do you have any thoughts around that conversation?
[00:34:39]
Erin: I know I've stayed out of it. , I think totally can if you don't want to talk. No, no, no. I'm happy to talk about it. I'm just , , I was actually just talking about this, , on a podcast right before this. I think that Instagram is inherently going to require that we simplify things greatly and we cannot go into the depth that han design offers.
[00:35:02]
Erin: So , I think that if , if pop HD is just sharing all these little tidbits, but there's no real grounding beneath it, I don't think it's very effective. I think that my experience with han design is that I went through a very, as you know, a very traditional education, which I really struggled with because I didn't find it the most empowering one.
[00:35:17]
Erin: But the foundation was deep, you know what I mean? So I went hard on that traditional one and also was skepticism because I was , there's a lot of weird stuff in here. And, and . And a lot of really disempowering language, and I don't it, so I'm not going to use it. And so, , I think that I have taken a lot of liberties in terms of translating han design, as you know, and, , into language that I find more accessible.
[00:35:41]
Erin: But also my, my foundation is really strong. So, , the translation is coming because, , I know, I know the foundation is deep, and I'm able to kind of speak about it in a way that retains its meaning, but is able to access more people. And so , I think that's great. I think people should do it. I think that , it will allow han design to reach so many more audiences because where I was struggling in 2015 is that han design was communicated about in such kind of rigid, alienating ways.
[00:36:07]
Erin: And it wasn't accessible to many people. And now we have many people that are really translating it and speaking about it beautifully. So , I think it's amazing. I'm not really going to criticize the way that anyone shares, , but I see a lot of stuff that showed on Instagram that is just totally disconnected and not aligned with any of the source material, you know, and sometimes in really disempowered ways, I've had clients sit and they're , I heard this thing.
[00:36:29]
Erin: And I'm , who told you that? , you know, , and so , I don't know, it's a balance. , I think that , honestly, if it's helping people, it's helping people. And that's really all that matters to me. I think that , but I do think that. As long as our foundation is strong, I think that we should feel free to translate things in a way that makes sense to us and will make sense to other people.
[00:36:49]
Erin: And I feel the deeper my foundation is, the more free I am able to do that, and , the better I am because I can speak to the simplicity of something because I actually understand it. Where I feel it's not useful is , if the foundation isn't really there, and so it's not really translated in a way that retains any of the meaning.
[00:37:04]
Leah: Yeah, 100%. For me, in my han design journey, when I first started, I took more of a I've taken a lot of routes when learning han design. it started with me with more of the, , , I guess I would say the pop HD world, I guess that's what people call it. , so I started my first training with, with Jenna and, you know, it was, it was interesting.
[00:37:24]
Leah: And I think what I found was , I needed more. And I, and so then I went down this whole sort of journey of learning in a very deep level. And I was , okay, I'm going to find all the source material. So I started joining different groups and, , you know, subscribing to different platforms where I could, you know, get some of the docents and spending a lot of time reading.
[00:37:44]
Leah: I'm a five one. So , that was just natural for me. I have seven, one lines in my chart. So I was , all right, I'm going to dive deep. And then I kind of had this. Very much of a, , I was really disappointed in the han design community for a minute because I was , no one is doing , no one's talking about this the right way.
[00:38:01]
Leah: , this is actually what this thing means. And so I had this whole, , I guess I would, I kind of got on my high horse a little bit. And I was , why is it , people are speaking about this wrong. No one knows what it actually means of the deeper layers. And then I think I found in my experiment that I actually came back around where I was , no, this needs to be more accessible.
[00:38:18]
Leah: And so now I find that I, I always say kind of fall somewhere in between where , I to be. Really digestible. And that's what I love about you so much because you're such a, you bring in such a language that I'm , yes, this makes so much sense. And so I found that I wanted more of that, but I wanted, when someone's ready to go deep, I'm able to provide that at that right time, but I'm not going to dive into something really nuanced and layered unless someone's really ready for that.
[00:38:43]
Leah: , so I find that. It's not going to land. Yeah. So I love that you speak a little bit about just that experience. And I think that you're just someone that I constantly reference where I'm , Aaron is, you know, so great to learn from just because he helps break it down and she has that foundation for sure.
[00:39:00]
Erin: Yeah. And it's both. Yeah. People are all going to have a different approach, you know, that was mine and that is yours. , but I do think that , when you really understand it, it's much easier to translate it.
[00:39:11]
Leah: So when it comes to just han design and, , you know, being a business owner, how has han design impacted your business?
[00:39:20]
Leah: And , and obviously you do han design. So of course it has an impact in that way, but in the way that you structure your business and being a projector and,
[00:39:27]
Erin: and all of that, I as a projector and especially as a business owner, , I always remind projectors that , well, I guess there are two big pieces.
[00:39:36]
Erin: One, . You're not here to really do it all alone. Honestly, none of us are, but ideally projectors are in a business where they can really hone in on their gifts and have support for the rest, which might not be possible immediately. I think that my gifts are sharing about han design and speaking about han design and writing content on han design.
[00:39:53]
Erin: I'm not great at strategy. I'm not, I'm, I'm , okay, at marketing and sales, but , I'm not really great at , honestly, any operational system, business thing, just not my thing, you know, but I did come from this really entrepreneurial community in New York city. So I was , I'm going to be great at it all.
[00:40:07]
Erin: I'm , you know, I really attempted to in my first business didn't go well. So I think that where I found success in the business is. My job in our business is to be the han design person. I do not do any of the other things. I do not do strategy. I do not do operations. , and so, , that's really allowed me to succeed as a projector because, , I'm just, , squarely in my lane.
[00:40:28]
Erin: And I feel I am offered a structure to just play within. And, , that might not work for every projector. It's really, really worked for me. So that's been a big piece. And, , really allowing a support, which is hard, especially in having a baby. I'm just, , I'm just, , I have gate 21. I'm just, , I just have to retain some control.
[00:40:43]
Erin: And so, . It's just this, you know, slow process of being . I have to let it all go, you know, and , , and let it transform. I think the other big piece is that when I first started the business, , or first of my own practice, that was an early 2017, January, I was just doing sessions and I would make my little, I called it a han you all the time.
[00:41:02]
Erin: And then it became the blueprint. , I would kind of write this PDF that I would give people for each session. And it was , I was totally booked up. It was really fun, but I also . I couldn't really grow the business beyond raising my prices because I was just sitting in sessions all day and fitting them in wherever I could.
[00:41:17]
Erin: And my partner was just , Aaron, , it feels the thing that you're making the written guide for people is really valuable on its own. , what if you just started on that? And I was , I don't know what people really buy that, you know? And I remember putting it in my Instagram story and people just started demoing me.
[00:41:31]
Erin: I don't think we even we're set up then, you know, on Stripe or any other things. And Jared was , you know, Aaron, , sorry, that's my partner. He was , when we sell a hundred of these, we'll know what really works, you know, and then we'll kind of make it more beautiful. And , we actually didn't make more beautiful until we sold 10, 000 of them.
[00:41:45]
Erin: But , I think at that point we were just , oh, this really works, you know? So I think that , I share that example to say that , I have learned as a projector that if I sit with people one on one, I can only do so many things. It'll be hard to grow the business in the way that I want to.
[00:41:59]
Erin: And so a big part of our business has been , how can we scale the offerings beyond me? And so how can we impact much more people with the knowledge of han design, but in a way that doesn't require me to scale up my effort alongside that. , and the course was another great example of being able to kind of teach and really be in it, be able to access many people at once, you know?
[00:42:16]
Erin: And, and so I think that's been kind of a constant journey as well. , It's I've worked a lot, you know, I have really hustled over the past many years, but a lot of it has been a lot of hustle at the beginning to make it a lot easier later on. , and so it's been really fun to kind of think about ways to continue to scale the offerings in a way that feels really sustainable for my energy.
[00:42:34]
Leah: Oh my gosh, it's so interesting. I didn't know that was your story because I, so I do something a little bit similar. , they're called chart smaries, but they used to be, I should say, and I, it was the same sort of thing because my background was I worked in corporate America and I found han design and.
[00:42:48]
Leah: It was honestly a party trick for me at the time. I was on this han design thing and my girlfriends would come over and we'd drink wine and I'd be , let me get your han design. And I was doing a training and then I was reading these books. And then I think it was one person to the next.
[00:43:00]
Leah: It became very apparent that this was, I guess, kind of growing into its own business where people are , Hey, , well, my, my mom wants to sit down with you or Hey, my . My good friend in this friend group really wants to, you know, hear more about what you're doing. And so then it became this business and it's the, I did the exact same thing.
[00:43:15]
Leah: I started writing up and I think maybe because the first reading I had had a little kind of info sheet after. And so I wrote an info sheet, Okay. This is info about your type and this is info about your profile. And then a little kind of nuggets that I pulled out from just different parts and just bullet points.
[00:43:30]
Leah: And that's all it was. And then when I couldn't do han design at a very demanding corporate job, I was working fortune 500 it, I had the whole career sort of laid out for me. And when I was in that position, I remember at one point going, I just, I, I can't really sit with people I it's exhausting for me at the end of my day.
[00:43:48]
Leah: And so I ended up, , kind of making these, what I called them, , basics chart smary. Yeah. And I sold them on Etsy, and I did that for a long time, and then I did, , an in depth version, and it was so, , deep. , I remember some people loved it, and then some people were , I don't know what I'm reading here.
[00:44:03]
Leah: Yeah. It was , if you have a if you were a center is colored in I was breaking down han design I was teaching it to someone and it was just not accessible. But it's so interesting because I find that that's I think that that's so true and you know one of the things I'm really passionate about in han design is just being able to bring it to people in in more ways I want people I want everyone at some point I want everyone to know han design that is , and I keep saying this to people I'm if you.
[00:44:30]
Leah: If you don't know what han design is, you may hear me say this word all the time, or you may have looked at my page or have seen something on Instagram, but if you don't know what it is, I promise you in five years, you will know what your han design is because you won't have a choice.
[00:44:43]
Leah: Cause it's , I feel it's really going to do kind of what astrology did, which brings me to my next question. Where do you see the future of han design evolving? And how do you see your work kind of being a part of that? Evolving
[00:44:56]
Erin: system, you know, I think far, far in the future, I think at a certain point we won't need han design I think that will , I don't know if I don't know if we're good there in a long time, but , I think that han design validates the things that we already know about ourselves and it gives us more permission to step into them.
[00:45:11]
Erin: And I think the younger people are, the more they're often living it and then they get conditioned out of it and then return to it later in life. And so, , I just, yeah, I just feel there is a possibility in which, , it's so normalized that we are all so different and we do things differently.
[00:45:24]
Erin: There are different ways of working that, , we might know it in honor from an early age and han design can validate that back to us, but we're already doing it. You know, , as you probably experienced with clients, when I share han design with people, I am not telling them anything new and just giving them a language for things they've always known and never allowed, you know?
[00:45:40]
Erin: And so, , I kind of see the very, very future of han design is , we won't need it. , because we already feel all the permission. I think probably there's a lot of steps in between that, you know, and , it'd be so cool to see it integrated into parenting more, which it is a lot more often, in the schools, all the stuff, you know, I think that it gives us such utter permission to do things differently, and it is really fun to kind of hear it become just a language that people use.
[00:46:04]
Erin: , I think in terms of my role. You know, it's been really interesting. I think that the business that we built has been very much around my name and my presence and me as the teacher. And it's been amazing, you know, and now having taught a lot of other people to share han design and help people that already know han design to just continue to deepen their studies.
[00:46:25]
Erin: I think that it's really , we're just at a point in the business where it's really , we're just transcending me. It's not about me anymore. It's about , Really creating a platform for people to go to if they want a really practical, empowering, accessible, and useful experience of han design.
[00:46:40]
Erin: And so , the vision with our business and with Blueprint is very much just to become that, just to become a really easy, accessible, useful place to learn about han design. And to find so many amazing people that are sharing it. Because , while people might resonate with my language, , they might actually have a much better experience with somebody else because that's just more who they want to sit with or read with, you know?
[00:46:58]
Erin: I think that's kind of the, the journey we are in of just kind of transcending me and letting it become something bigger than that, you know, it's weird. It's hard. It's crunchy, you know, , but I think that teaching the course has really just reminded me how many amazing people there are sharing han design and how differently they share it.
[00:47:17]
Erin: And , I've got my way, but there are so many other amazing ways. When people are empowered to build successful businesses and have that, they can reach way more people because I've got my people and they have so many more, you know? So I think that I really, we're really oriented towards kind of supporting those people and becoming a platform for that.
[00:47:33]
Erin: Love that.
[00:47:34]
Leah: I love that so much. , and I love being a part of it. I love, you know, tuning into your sessions every month and being a part of the course. Cause you know, I, I haven't tapped into any of your live ones recently, but, , you know, just the first round was incredible. I'll share that from the rooftop.
[00:47:50]
Leah: So, yeah, Erin, it's been so great hearing about you and your business and what it means to be a projector to you. And I'm just so honored to know you and get a chance to just sit with you. So, thank you so much for the time. And I can't wait to continue to. To be involved with whatever magic you create.
[00:48:07]
Erin: My pleasure. Thank you so much for having me.
